i have written some responses to new tool posts on occasion here but thought i would go ahead and sign up and write about something that’s bugging me. i switched over to bosch power tools some years back and my main motivation was the quality bump. a while back i bought a bosch GLM 80 laser measuring tool and it was defective. the electronics would not allow the option to read in inches and feet to be be toggled on. i am not an idiot.AND i di read the instructions. it simply would not work. i sent it back.
last week i bought the bosch PB360s radio/charger from amazon. this unit will not allow me to program the radio stations. yeah, i have to send it back and its a boat anchor.
what’s going on with bosch electronics? 2 things before i go in order to prevent possible trolling: 1) i read and followed the instructions and 2) no, i am genuinely not an idiot.
And Bosch’s detectors for electric cables, metal and timber studs in walls are notoriously awful. Mine was so unreliable as to be useless. Not a cheap tool either.
On the other hand, I have three of their corded drills and the classic GST60PBE jigsaw that are great.
Other parts of the company make auto electronics which have to be reliable. Time for one part of the company to learn from the other !
i can’t help but wonder if they have two different design and research divisions. one overseas where they produce the cordless handheld measuring and sensing tools and the other somewhere in germany where the corded tools and probably even the cordless drills, drivers and saws are designed.
i suspect the 2 halves of the company may not be subject to the same design scrutiny. this makes buying these types of tools from bosch an iffy prospect.
this is all just a guess on my part. i am fairly invested in the bosch form factor and won’t be switching out but i am going to be very reticent to buy another laser tool or jobsite radio or…
Maybe its a QA/QC thing too. With production in so many different places - perhaps there is a lack of consistency.
As an example - looking at what Bosch tools I own the COO varies:
My GCM12SD miter saw was made in China - and I think it a very good tool - but others seem to have had quality issues.
My 4100DG table saw was made in Taiwan - and I like it for what it is - but others report premature motor failures
The GMS120 wall scanner I bought came from Malaysia - and I found it less than useful
My Bosch Routers (1617EVSPK and Colt PR20EVSK) were made in Mexico - and they are excellent - as was the older 1608 Laminate Trimmer kit - which was made in the USA
My German-made Bosch 11264EVS Rotohammer and 1773AK concrete grinder, are good tools but I had issue with the their 1365 abrasive cutoff machine needing repair several times.
My old Bosch jigsaws were made in the USA - and these (1584VS and 3294EVS) do yeoman work.
I like my newer Swiss-Made Bosch jigsaws (JS572EN, and JS572EBL) but I think they have a few design foibles.
Every Bosch tool I’ve ever used has been a stellar performer (table and miter saws, SDS and hammer drills) though I’ve never owned any nor used electronic items. I agree with Fred, possible problems on the QC end and likely hood that they may be of different OEMs as even major brands often do not make all their items in house.
for me this brings up a tangential question about marketing and reputation. when i bought the glm80 laser measuring too on amazon l i noticed (after the fact) that there were dozens of complaints about this tool and they were pretty specific. it turns out that i had exactly those problems with the tool and it made it unusable. sure, it went back. all of the other tools by those of people went back too. it leads to the point where people start bringing it up on forums. when does the cumulative damage affect the company’s reputation and question their fidelity to quality? the big selling point about bosch is that, although more expensive, they are well made and reliable. if one division of your company is undercutting the reputation of the company of the whole then when do you pull that tool from the market and inspect it for design flaws. sure, its a major move but in this connected world your reputation for attention to QC and/or design quality is a fluid thing. you can’t have a major company like bosch, whose rep is centered upon quality, pumping out a product - even one - that has such serious flaws. every time i have to manually change the stations on that pb360 jobsite radio i get slightly peeved at bosch because the station presets did not work straight outta the box. this adds up.
I think most of us would agree that no reputable company starts out wanting to make a shoddy product - especially one that will result in lots of returns, and customer complaints. But maybe there is one or more disconnects along the way from design through manufacture to end-use and then to customer feedback about the product. Perhaps the “message” being sent by customers who are not satisfied - return the product for refund etc. is diluted by others who do not complain. I expect that even with a product that many of us would consider superb, there will be a distribution of opinion and possible reviews by the buying public. Even with good products - one can expect that the “fleet” of them will have some that suffer from “infant mortality” and some that will go on working long past expectations. But that’s not exactly what we are talking about here - where a new product garners a large number of complaints - and negative reviews start outweighing positive ones. Sometimes I wonder about reviews on Amazon. I general dismiss their validity when the number of them seem too few to be statistically significant. Other times I can not fathom how skewed the reviews are - except perhaps with the thought that different reviewers use tools very differently and it is sometimes hard to discern the context in which the review was made. Giving manufacturers the benefit of the doubt, they probably take this into account - and have developed some tolerance for bad reviews as an acceptable “cost of doing business” - or perhaps dismissing bad reviews as flukes or from “whiners” based on misuse or unrealistic expectations. I would hope that Bosch has something akin to a TQM program to bubble buyer complaints up their chain and then take action to fix things - but sometimes in big companies bad news is not welcomed and the bearer of evil tidings is shunned or worse.
well said fred. in this case, because the problem seems to be specifically with the electronics, that there is some of sort of disconnect between divisions of the company. there also seems to be a disconnect between the european and u.s. marketing departments but that’s the subject of a separate discussion.
Btw welcome to the Toolguyd discussion. You will find @fred is a indispensable mind here, I myself just feel good about leaving random comments… Lol we look forward to your continued input.
thanks for the welcome and merry christmas (or happy holidays) to all on the list. i am in northern california so when the temps drop down below 60 we are racing for our ear muffs and mukluks. brrrrrr, 58.
on another note i feel as though i have disparaged bosch a bit with my comments about shoddy electronics so here is positive note for them.
i bought their FL12 LED flashlight https://www.boschtools.com/us/en/boschtools-ocs/cordless-lights-fl12-121246-p/ and have found it be great. i use it all the time. if you have adopted the bosch 12v. form factor then this flashlight would be a great stocking stuffer…for yourself. no bells and whistles on this light, it doesn’t signal S.O.S. or anything but it does light up the area really well and its surprisingly durable. i have dropped it off a scaffolding twice (pro tip: do not slide the clip behind your belt so that the flashlight hangs just by sitting on your belt. the flashlight will squirt out when you are clambering around and voila - you have done a drop test.) the light has never stopped working and the charge lasts for quite a while. it doesn’t take up much room in a toolbag although it does seem to want to turn on sometimes when jostled around in the tool bag. the magnetic holder is handy on the scaffold and the caribiner hook works great on the hammer loop of your pants if you turn the light around so that it faces forward when you walk. this will illuminate your path and leave you hands-free. note - there is a small pin on the caribiner arm and it started to walk out of my unit. i just drove it back in with a nail and peened over the soft aluminum around it - problem fixed. its a pretty handy flashlight. kudos to the bosch designer/s on this one.